About cricinfoblogs cricinfo.com
Blogs home
Men in White Pak Spin Rob's Lobs Tour Diaries Sarwan and Gayle
Beyond The Test World On the circuit Cricinfo Select What's new The Surfer

Cricinfo Blogs Home

« Goliath's fear of the little Davids | | Wake up and smell the opportunity »

July 24, 2007

Posted 8:28 AM in India in England, 2007

Flabby in the middle



Mahendra Singh Dhoni acquitted himself well despite his technical difficulties against the moving ball © Getty Images

Sambit Bal

Did India really deserve to save the Test? You could say their bowlers did, for after a shocking opening session when they were affected as much by nerves as by lack of practical knowledge about overcoming and using the unique slope at Lord's, they exceeded expectations. You could also hand it to Dinesh Karthik, a young man thrust into a difficult job, who showed both skill and heart, and Mahendra Singh Dhoni, who rose above his technical difficulties against the moving ball to hang in there. India owes this draw to these unlikely saviours and the benevolence of the weather.

But there is a story within a story. India's three fifties in this Test came from the weakest links: Wasim Jaffer, who came to this Test on the back of three failures; Karthik, who is not a opener; and Dhoni, who had batted like a tailender in the first innings. In the end, to hold out for 96 overs was creditable because it was always going to rain. In fact, it was a surprise that it didn't rain sooner than it did on day five. But what of the men who were expected to deliver for India?

India's mighty middle order came up against England's most enfeebled pace attack in a home Test since 1993 and managed only 192 runs. That's an average of 24. James Anderson cannot be denied credit. He bowled with intelligence and control but the conditions, while challenging, were never impossible. The first-innings score of 201 was probably 150 short of what was achievable.

Is it too early to make a reassessment of India's batting strength? Wasn't it a similar story in 2002, when the Indian middle order collapsed twice to lose them the Test at Lord's, only to reveal its full splendour in the matches that followed? That series, in fact, heralded a golden run for India lasting about 18 months. Now that they have the breathing space of a draw behind them, can they not be expected to flower again?

They well may, for far more unlikely things have happened in cricket. If you're a betting man, though, don't put your money on it yet. This is a batting order that has long lived on reputation; three years, to be precise. Not since the tour of Pakistan in early 2004 has India's middle order earned the right to be termed mighty.

Let's dispense with the numbers first. In Test matches since that series, Sachin Tendulkar averages 45.67, Sourav Ganguly 36.24 and VVS Laxman 33.70. But even these numbers hide the reality for none them has failed to cash in on weak opponents. Three of Tendulkar's last four hundreds - including a career-best 248 - have come against Bangladesh, Ganguly has scored hundreds against Zimbabwe and Bangladesh, his only centuries since a stirring 144 against Australia at Brisbane in 2003, and Laxman has got a hundred against Zimbabwe. Remove these runs and the story is dire. Tendulkar's average dips to 31.19, Ganguly's to 29.40 and Laxman's to 32.19.

Increasingly it looks likely that this is what India's once-glittering middle order is capable of providing in demanding conditions: battling thirties and the odd half-century. That's what Tendulkar, Laxman and Ganguly provided at Lord's and that's what they did against Australia, Pakistan and South Africa in 2004-05, and against South Africa earlier this year. More than 20 Tests in the space of three years is a long enough sample period to present a pattern and, despite what the rest of this series might bring, it's about time to bury the myth about India's middle order.

India's batting in recent years has been about two men. One of them isn't here. Despite his failure in South Africa, Virender Sehwag averages 46.89 in Tests since May 2004 and, incredibly, his average goes a couple of points higher if you remove his Tests against Zimbabwe.

The other is Rahul Dravid, who averages nearly 50 without his runs against Zimbabwe and Bangladesh. India missed a big innings from him in South Africa. It was the first time since 2000 that he'd gone through a series without a half-century and it perhaps cost India the series. In both innings at Lord's he was dismissed without getting in, which is not something that can be said about Tendulkar, Laxman and Ganguly.

Batsmen who get into the 30s can't be described as out of form. But the failure to push on from there must point to something. Has the process of survival become so onerous that it is draining away the mental resources needed to construct more substantial innings? Can the body no longer endure the rigour? Is it a combination of both?

Indian cricket would be living in denial if it fails to acknowledge the decline. Cherish their golden years but don't expect them to light up a wet summer.

Comments

Posted by: sanka on 07/24/2007

No. Not at all

Posted by: Rajeev on 07/24/2007

Excellant article. Numbers tell the story. That explains our poor test record. Otherwise, why with so many batsman averaging in 50s and higher 40s, we fail to win even 25% of test matches.

Posted by: Rajesh on 07/24/2007

If any of the following, plays below a strike rate of 50 then, that means they are not confident about them at all: Sachin, Saurav and Laxman. I dont think any one from the above list is playing with confidence. They themselves think tat they are gone case. What's the point in we believing in them? They should be chucked out, if they do not perfrom, at the end of this English tour.

Posted by: chetan on 07/24/2007

The problem with most of Indian fans is that they seem to have very little faith and patience, more so the experts.. A single failure, they try and rip apart statistics... afterall somebody once said " statistics are like bikinis, they show the obvious and hide the vital", and experts seem to be just playing with numbers and pointing out things. Playing at international level has as much an element of chance as of skill. Sometimes things go one's way and sometimes they do not... even the best innings of the best players, have had fortunate escapes in them. experts would do well to remember that....After all nobody wants to fail...

Posted by: shree on 07/24/2007

No way! the trio - SRT, SVG, and VVS are paper tigers! we need people who deliver when the going gets tough - like Ponting! We need to dump VVS and Ganguly and get fresh blood.

Posted by: Deepak on 07/24/2007

You can relate this batting line up to one proverb which suits the entire situation which is " GOOD FOR NOTHING ".. Never call a batting or bowling line up mighty unless and until they execute things and bring success to our country.

Posted by: Syam on 07/24/2007

The obituaries sound ominous, and we all agree it is time to practice them, probably even Sachin, Saurav and Laxman. Before we get carried away by doom and gloom, a couple of things:
1) India has not played in these conditions in a while and will get used to them soon, including the newer bowlers like Sidebottom and Tremlett.
2) While the confidence of Sachin, Saurav and Laxman is down, they did all get their eye in against the english bowlers. Laxman is probably already in the groove. Sachin will get a century somehow, even if he has to scrap his way to it, and if he does that on Friday, England is in for a long summer.
3) Saurav is playing accumulator, and while this is not pretty, we need someone to do it. The "dada" we have all known is a fighter, and while he is not in his prime anymore, and a lot more circumspect, I am sure we will still get one fine innings out of him.
They are old, and the bones are creaking, the horizon looks close and inviting, every day is a little bit tougher to get through, but Sachin, Rahul, Saurav and Laxman - they are winners all, and they dont like this anymore than you do. Weary they maybe, and they may not light but a candle, but dont mistake the desire in each to script a swansong of an innings in the next two tests. A bit more familiarity, and a bit of luck and anything is possible. A funny game this...

Posted by: Srini on 07/24/2007

If you look around, the ones who call our middle order mighty are actually the media outside of India. And they have reasons. The longer these three relics play, the longer teams have a chance of beating India. So it suits them fine to praise the odd Sachin innings or the odd flourish from Ganguly's bat! What we need is a middle order reading- Dravid, Yuvraj, Manoj Tiwari, Suresh Raina!

Posted by: Saif on 07/24/2007

I agree with the article 100%. I guess the "Trinity" or the trio no longer have the drive or the same hunger as before. It can not be the age factor as many batsmen were in their prime in their 30's (Graham Gooch for an example).
It has to do with Maselow's need hierarchy theory, the only exception being the fact that for the "trio" self actualization does not exist or maybe they achieved it too soon for their countries good.
They don't have any reason left to play for.

Posted by: vineet gupta on 07/24/2007

Mighty huh!! thats the last word comes to my mind while thinking about Indian Middle order..probably fragile is the more appropriate word. and I am sorry to say that weakest link has been Sachin Tendulkar.If we look at his record in Test Cricket for last 3-4 years or so,not only he has been highly inconsistent but also out of sorts whenever he has got runs..his last 3 out of 4 centuries have come against bangladesh which tells most of the story.Sachin post 2003 has been a one score wonder in most of the series.In Australia 2003-04 he only scored one decent score 241* and that also in highly unlike sachin way..same in Pakistan 193* and in many series after that he has't got runs against any big opposition.But I would like to add one more thing, if u think it's his abilites which are letting him down then u r wrong, it's just the fear of failure. Now a days he is so afraid of getting out playing attacking shots that he goes in to a shell, plays uncharacteristic cricket and eventually gets out..and that really hurts to ppl who are not accustom to see Sachin in this form. I am afraid to say I can't see sachin doing any thing in this series or any of the future series with consistency..may be he can come up with a wonder of one innings here and there otherwise for him it's over..and I would be more than happy to eat my words

Posted by: Ram on 07/24/2007

It's time people simply stop talking in the collective, and - Mukul Kesavan did this recently - start talking of Rahul Dravid as a man apart from the fading galacticos...

Posted by: Raj Thapar on 07/24/2007

Out with the old and in with the new. How much longer can India "depend" on the usual stalwarts of Sachin, Laxman and Ganguly. Whilst I did agree with Sehwag's temporary banishment, I can only think that he should be reinstated in the Test side, along with Yuvraj Singh and dare I say it, Harbhjan Singh. Who do we replace? Sourav, Sachin/Laxman and Kumble - all have served India well in the past but seem to be battling for lost form.

Dravid is excluded from the list, partly because he is a fantastic bat, rated higher than Sachin in terms of winning games for India, also because of the lack of captaining options available to India.

Posted by: Satish on 07/24/2007

I like the analysis except that the article is a little unfair on Laxman. This guy has to bat at number three when he faces Australia and is suddenly batting at number seven again weaker opponents like England. He has never been accorded the respect that mediocre test match batsmen like Ganguly gets. The problem with the India team is that everyone else has to continue to make compromises to accomodate the interests of the bigwigs like Tendulkar, Dravid, Ganguly and the likes. Game tactics and situation is never brought into the equation. Another joke India is going through is playing two wicket keepers. Dinesh Kaarthik is not a batsman. he cannot continue to receive laurels for scoring 30s and 40s... He is batting at the top of the order and teams that win, have their top line batsman scoring big hundreds. They should really bring in a specialist opener and give his as long a stint as this lucky scratchy batsman like Kaarthik is getting and surely, you will find a genuine opener for the long run. That way, batsmen like Yuvraj don't have to carry drinks watching two wicketkeepers fight it out in the middle. This game is not about individuals. They have to first put together a decent enough team.

Posted by: eddy on 07/24/2007

So both Lara and Tendulkar finish their careers without a hundred at headquarters, you can can Ponting to that stat as well but he has at least one or two series to change that. i agree with your assessment of the indian middle order and especially tendulkar. He's now 34, scored one ton in a year and before that(injuries noted) one other ton in a year. His avg has dropped from 58 ish to 55(still brilliant) but at 34 Lara was still capable of scoring double hundreds against SA and SL and 400* V eng. i fear injuries have taken there toil on Sachin and we've seen the best of him. eddy

Posted by: Ravi Kumar on 07/24/2007

Excellent Article...i agree with Sambit and 20 tests is more than a sample to understand the trend. Every time Sachin and VVS are on the field they immediately switch on the survival mode and enter themselves into a shell irrespective of the team's situation, be it 10/3 or 200/3. Though Sourav showed glimpses of his class in the limited test appearences he made after comeback, much more is expected of him.

sachin in particular should do some introspection...not jus making statements that he knows when to retire. Nobody is concerned about his body state or mind state, its how much are you contributing to the team's success. If you are unable to do it then move out. One century for the sake of statistics in 10 matches is of no use.

Posted by: Murali on 07/24/2007

While I agree with your article, you have let Dravid easily just by saying that he did not get the starts. Is that a reason not to be held accountable? He played most uncharacterstic shots and getting himself out cheaply. Where is his so called technique? Our WALL is crumbling, maybe I should say already crumbled. He is only adding to the pressure, so mention that too in your future articles.

Posted by: N Vathabi Varanan on 07/24/2007

Excellent article. Why we go after the tried hands who failed in South Africa. Why don't we try players like Tiwari or Padrinath in the middle order. The so called seniors appear to takes things granted as they very well know that we are capable of forgetting incidents like the recently concluded World Cup and yersterday's Lord Test. Even we loose with a new set up and we would be happy that the new ones acquire some very good knowledge, but the seniors do not appear to have the mind to fight fight fight. Our Selectors should take some drastic steps after this tour so that new lads who certainly aspire to bring glory to their nation like what an Australian or other country player does in critical juncture.

Posted by: Shyam on 07/24/2007

i think the figures tell the story, the thing with sachin is that...if he is dropped....whole of India will get on the back of the staff!

With Saurav its different...he is a fighter and deserves the spot in the team

Laxman doesnot deserve to be in the team, not in England anyway where the ball swings a lot. His body language is such that disappoints other players and the viewers. He could be dropped for Gambhir or Yuvraj who would relish the chance and are also better fielders than laxman.

Wasim Jaffer is also someone who is negative and can be replaced by Gambhir because he has been performing better than Jaffer.

Posted by: Senthil Kumar on 07/24/2007

Don't worry the mighty three will fire on all cylinders soon enough. It is not as if they are 55 years old, for heaven's sake. With today's physios, they should all be able to play quite well for another 3-4 years in the least, and score big runs. Just watch.

Posted by: AMIT GANGULI on 07/24/2007

We should not write them off just as of yet, that would be typical Indian attitude, just a game back we were remembering the wins against South Africa and said that the famed Indian batting line-up is back on track. We should not be so quick to draw conclusions either way. They have been selected for the complete tour and only at the end of it can or should any conclusions be drawn. Rather we should see the positives that have come out of this test match, we have seen India capitulate far easily in the final innings of test matches both overseas as well at home, images coming to mind are those against Pakistan at home in 2005, England in 2006 and South Africa in 2007. However inspite of the rain gods saving India this time, and the Indian captain terming it as 'getting out of jail', one should not ignore the fact that India have batted out more than 95 overs in this test in the last innings to save the game. One thing that should be understood is that statistics is a kind of mathematics that can be shown in any light one wants to show them. Also when the Indian batting line up is termed as strong it very much includes Mahendra Singh Dhoni, and he once again reaffirmed that he is nearly there along with the likes of Yuvraj, Kartik, Sehwag(hopefully) to gradually replace our previous awe-inspiring legendary greats, however there is still some time for that to happen.

Posted by: jay on 07/24/2007

the thing is these guys are experienced they have played more tests than the rest of the guys put together.our people believe that they can still repeat their feat when they were at the peak of the form.But they have started becoming less consistent especially in the test arena.its high time they are thrown out and fresh faces are brought in.

Posted by: Navdeep on 07/24/2007

Well i cant remember of any occasion in the last 5 years where we have managed to save a test match on the final day,leave alone winning a test match.It is interesting to note that during the last five years,Tendulkar only averages 21 in the fourth innnings.To compound this he has not scored a single score in excess of 50 in the 4th innings.Infact what is even more astonishing is that the last time Tendulkar ever went past 50 in the 4th innings of a test match was at Chennai Vs Pakistan in 1999 where he scored 136.Ricky Ponting in the same period averages 91 and Matt Hayden 50 in the 4th innings.I think out batsmen are nuthing more than flat track bullies.

Posted by: Karthik on 07/24/2007

Samit, I think the main reason for the flabby performance of the Indian middle order is because of the poor show of Dravid. Atleast in the last 5 tests against the strong opponents like SA and Eng, Dravid failed with mere 109 runs in the 6 innings which avgs around 18.17. In the same tests Sachin, Saurav are averaging around the average of around 35. (I am not considering the performance against Bangladesh). The poor show of Dravid added additional pressure on the middle order which results a flabby performance by the famed order.

Posted by: Jay on 07/24/2007

a good article but arent u forgetting that they all made hundreds in the tour to Australia...241,178,144,,,Hmmm we seem to be foretting....But neways good article and i think that the INDIAN Batting DESERVES the term mighty .....Lets give them some time to acheive what we all know they can do..Lets face it if we cud do better we wud be out there...

Posted by: DR.VINUKONDAIAH on 07/24/2007

TENDULKAR HAS NEVER PERFORMED WHEN IT MATTERED MOST AND ALL HIS WEALTH OF RUNS COUNT FOR NOTHING AS HE FAILED IN AWAY SERIES.

Posted by: Sreedhar on 07/24/2007

You are absolutely right my freind, its time for a change, I love cricket and I love what Sachin and Saurav has done for our nation and I admire how Sachin draws respect all around the world. But before he loose his respect he should step down.

I know he has 2-3 years left in him may be until next world cup, but what's fun?? Sambit, if you have stats for must win situations (chasing like this 4th innings Vs England) I'll bet Sachin's average will be below 20.

I hate to say that these days, its safe to bet for Sachin's failure in crucial matches. LBW in tow innings (one to quickie and one to spinner) proves that he is not middling the ball and loosing his confidence.

For a man compared to Bradman games supreme God, its time to take a bow before he is compared to chokers.

Reg, Ganguly, I feel that he is playing to keep his place and prove a point or two but not with 100% heart. He is also capable of producing results for India and he is a better player in crucial and tense situations than Sachin.

VVS isn't very very special anymore, also his place is never permanent in Indian side.

Time to think about likes of Kaif, who can bat well when it matters most.

Thanks,
Sreedhar

Posted by: Venkatesan K S on 07/24/2007

Do not just talk about averages, it is the fighting attitude that always carries you forward. Relentlessly fight against your opponnents like a pack of wolves, like the Australians/Champions do, you almost always win. The Winning/Attacking attitude is clearly missing in almost all members of our team. Until this deficiency is eradicated, our team is not even worthy enough to be discussed about. See those lost look on their faces during situations of pressure, defeat is written all over it even before it really happens. See a Ricky Ponting / Graeme Smith / Spephen Fleming, they never show such signs on their faces till the decisive ball is bowled out. On the contrary, they firmly believe that they can always win. Hope the nation realizes this fact and our board takes some "REAL SERIOUS" steps to ensure our players start believing in themselves and firmly believe that they can also win.

The beauty that needs to be observed, just before play was called of in the Lords Test, was the Indian Dressing Room. What a pity, I could see the "Lion(s)" of past looking up to the sky, rather than to have bothered to spend time out in the middle of a "Win"able match. Yes one should observe the fact that, even if it was one less, our bowlers claimed all 20 English wickets, worthy enough to win a match. It is now left to our batsmen to ponder about ways, to atleast spend time, if not scorre runs out there on the field.

Posted by: Giridhar on 07/24/2007

Its high time for selectors to recognise the factor behind our losses and give more chances to batsmen like Yuvraj. The more time the batsmen of Yuvraj's calibre are sidelined the more damaging it is for Indian Cricket. Its high time for Ganguly and Laxman to say their goodbyes. We desperately need more hunger in the middle order.

Posted by: Suresh on 07/24/2007

Agreed. But one point everyone has forgot to address is the conditions under which India & England batted. Toss did play a vital role. On day 1, it was bright and sunny and England made the most of it by just loosing 4 wickets. The next day, under overcast conditions the remaining 6 wickets were gone for just 30 odd runs. India batted under the weather conditions that supported the bowlers and bundled out for 200. Even in the second innings, England did bat with a bright weather where as India had to play majority of time under bad weather. Had India batted first, I am sure there would have been a different writing on the wall. Having said this I am not backing our batsmen, but certainly want to make the point that things haven't happened on the same level field.

Posted by: jophy on 07/24/2007

Take off the trio Tendulkar, Ganguly and Dravid. Give chance yougsters like Yuvraj, Manoj Tiwari. Youngsters can only win international cricket matches. Its not a big thing we won Bangladesh series soundly. Show to win international matches against better teams.

Posted by: Suresh on 07/24/2007

Just to add. If India did not a deserve a draw due to the weather, I would say, the same weather did play a role in India's poor score in first innings.

Posted by: Devang on 07/24/2007

Nice article and as stated, Indian middle is order struggling to runs on the board. Since last couple of years I noticed that our middle order batsman try to defend and go in shell and give the opponent to create more pressure on them, especially in case of Sachin and Laxman. Why they cannot play their natural game? They are attacking player and that is their strength if you don’t play with strength you are as vulnerable as any ordinary batsmen.

Posted by: Janak Gupta on 07/24/2007

The Indian Middle Order IS STILL MIGHTY. The failure pointed out in this article about pushing on from 30s and 40s to build a big score has no link to age or body. There is a fear in the mind. If someone can assure these top four that their places are in no danger till a certain time, I am sure they would play their natural game. Presently they play too defensive cricket which is against their mindset. Someone must talk to them to play freely without fear going all out. The Insurance Policy is missing for these high valued players. They are instead being told to score runs to save their places in the team. This is a wrong way to deal with these talented players. For Gods sake someone tell these four to play their natural shots and attack bowlers without thinking too much for a win or loss.

Posted by: Anonymous on 07/24/2007

Right on! Tendulkar, especially. You can be certain that he will fail when India needs him most. Yet, we have these blind selectors and parochial supporters who will never think of dropping him. I fee sorry for VVS. He's never got a fair shake from the selectors and has to bat most times with tail enders. I get the feeling Ganguly is desperately hanging on. he is no longer the flowing strokeplayer he once was. But at least he is a fighter which Tendulkar definitely is not. I say its time to drop Tendulkar. The sky will not fall!

Posted by: Saurabh on 07/24/2007

Very true..we only have good players who play for their personal records & not for the country. Thats the reason whenever we need these players to perform in big match situations they chock. I think its high time that everyone around realises that our so called great batsmen have got nothing great in them anymore & they are just trying to lengthen their careers. I hope they are reading this.

Posted by: Pramod Koshy on 07/24/2007

What the article should have done is shown the middle order (Sachin, Saurav, Dravid and VVS) averages against countries other than Bangladesh and Zimbabwe and scores made in countries other than India. I don't think either of them have a good record. Its time to replace the whole bunch.

Posted by: naveen on 07/24/2007

ofcoz yes .. cant think of a new middle order at this time and even the change in a single player .All those mighty four should be there to get the team going . there are no exact replacements for them at this moment xcept for yuvraj , who doesnot seem to be fit for the fivedy game yet .. soo dont expect a fall inn from these great foursome batsman ...

Posted by: pasupathi on 07/24/2007

tendulkar is geneious in middle order. laxman won the first test against south africa in recent tour.ganguly also looking good. this is a perfect middle order.only problem is remove dhoni and make karthik as a keeper and put proper opener, some one like akash chopra.

Posted by: Pranab Sen on 07/24/2007

All the comments are fine and convincing, but is BCCI listening? Why not send the whole blog to them and shower them with similar others?

Posted by: Ilango on 07/24/2007

Not Mighty!!! Are you joking? How much money these guys make? How much others get?

Posted by: Gaurav Bijlani on 07/24/2007

Good on paper poor on the day has always been the case abroad.It is not a surprise.I am sure,Dravid is the man for all ocassions,Laxman might win India a series or two abroad,Ganguly and Tendulkar might surprise with an innings or two but they are long past their prime.

Tendulkar hasnt played good shots for a long time against the likes of Shoaib,Murali,Vettori,Bond or so on so,how on earth do people refer to him as genius,batting maestro?

I wonder why we dont go with youngsters only afterall, no one expected the three fifties from relatively new players.

Posted by: Saajan on 07/24/2007

Yes, because you can't really say there not mighty because of a few games. All teams have their ups and downs and right now India is down and under and they will get back to the top but they need to try harder and get younger players into the team. The Batting line up is still mighty, Dravid is the wall of India, Dhoni the attacker of Indian line up, Sachin the legendary little master, Yuvraj the team saviour, and others. you cant say India's line up isn't mighty. There bowling is weak tho.

Posted by: Anonymous on 07/24/2007

Sachins skills are not on the wane - they are gone - we cant play pace - cant play spin and - we cannot bat 4 test sessions - simple as that . A batting side that cannot last 4 sessions against a decent bowling attack is not a batting side at all. Period.

Posted by: Robin Mitra on 07/24/2007

Numbers or not, the middle order is clearly on a downhill slope. Two out of three among Laxman, Tendulkar and Ganguly must give way to a rebuilding process.

Posted by: Varun Singh on 07/24/2007

It is embarrassing to see all the three so called mighty bat and Tendulkar more so than the others. I still do not know why Laxman was even included in this tour as people like him who depend on hand eye coordination and not technique, suffer when that process begins to slow down. Ganguli on the other hand as forced himself back in. The question is- do these three have the insight to realise it is time to pull out before being sacked. I do not think so.

None of them are behaving honourably I think, not as far as interests of India are concerned. Dravid on the other hand is different creature, who reminds one of Sunil Gavaskar. I have no doubt that part of the reason he is not performing is the pressure he is under, knowing that he can no longer depend on the other three players- not one bit.

Posted by: Indian on 07/24/2007

I think I agree with most of the people here. Indian middle order is not even 1% of being mighty. I think we need some fresh legs in the middle order. In tense situation we have seldom shown the character. I think attitude towards the game is not right. We need attacking players like Ricky ponting, Matty hayden, Adam gilchrist, Kevin Peterson and not players like Sachin tendulkar or Ganguly who trying to either improve their stats or just making an attempt to save the game. I guess the thought of winning a tough game is never on our minds. Lastly our bowlers are the most pathetic fast bowlers I have ever seen. None of them have either acurate yorker or feircesome short ball.
I think watching them play like this hurts and is waste of time.

Posted by: Hari Prabu on 07/24/2007

I don't think that there are many better options than the current middle order. The current middle order does work if the openers get a good start.

Posted by: sal sejpal on 07/24/2007

I think the indian middle order has never been mighty.There are brilliant players who perform individually but as a collective unit there are always two or three players who are struggling at any given time.I think the biggest problem with our middle order is their fear of getting out.You can just see it in their faces,the way they are batting.They make tremlett look like glenn mcgrath and what about monty?Tendulkar is fast becoming is bunny rabbit.It's been a known fact that indian batsman are not great against pace and bounce but now they struggling against spin as well.If the likes of tendulkar and ganguly don't start playingwithout fear i think someone like yuvraj should replace one of them.

Posted by: Mohan on 07/24/2007

As a follow-up to Sambit Bal's wonderful and provocative article quite a few fans have posted very sensible opinions on th epros and cons of dropping or not dropping mid-order 'oldies'. I realise this is just an opinion, but I'm of the view that generally speaking teams play from one world cup to the other (except for the Ashes series which retains some credibility). With this in view, and in the absence of RedSox Vs Yankees type of challenging, competitive and gladiatorial matches, I would humbly suggest calling Messrs. Tendulkar, Ganguly and Laxman for a party at BCCI, giving them a golden handshakeand some champagne and shipping them off into the pages of Cricinfo Stats. We have work to do and matches to win and crowds to motivate and need the likes of Raina, Gambhir, Yuvraj, (maybe) Kaif, Rayudu, Chopra etc etc etc. I am very disappointed at the S. Asian mental make-up that includes such horrendous players like Durrani, Brijesh Patel, Srikkant, Sehwag etc. in the national teamof any sport. Please think for a moment of populations that prefer the spirit and fight of players like Ponting, Borders, Gatting, Gooch, Botham, Greig, Jayasurya, DeSilva, Pollocks, Astle, Bond, Turner, Chappells, Lawry, Simpson etc etc etc. When players do not perform, they are just shoved aside and the show goes on. It may be a good start to disband BCCI and to run the organisation as a business, where rewards are based on performance (read RUNS, WICKETS, CATCHES). There should be no grading of senior or junior players. If you fail in your mission three (preset number) times in a row, goodbye ! Before the players or board does anything (gulp !) WE the general population first needs to set boundaries on expectations and rewards. Before we treat ordinary people or players as Gods to fill the vaccuumin their own miserable lives, we need to put our own lives into perspective. I am hoping some of the above MAY bring about some improvement ?

Posted by: vinooth on 07/24/2007

All the three men mentioned are useless. They are not able to handle pressure. I think this is the best time to bring the young players to the team.

Posted by: Prabhu on 07/24/2007

Excellent article, Hats off to u, U wrote what i felt .... U r gutsy

Posted by: nathan persaud on 07/25/2007

I thought the flab in the middle was more physical.These guys are the most unathletic bunch of highly paid athletes in the world.Chanderpaul's batting during the recent series is even more significant now.Indian batsmen are bullies on the featherbeds in the sub continent. Losing the flab in the mid section might strengthen the midddle order. A 10 km fitness run followed by 500 situps is a good start.

Posted by: anil bhavsar on 07/25/2007

No matter who coaches for India, who manages, who captains, who vice-captains, India will always play the most boring cricket. They need to play some exciting cricket irrespective of results and records.

Posted by: Umesh Srinivasan on 07/26/2007

Sachin was 15+ when he toured Pakistan in 1989,do the selectors have the guts to blood a youngster,say Rohith Sharma ahead of the famed trio for atleast the Oval test? Most unlikely,Sachin will go on till he himself gets bored with the game.

Posted by: saumilzx.com on 07/27/2007

Our middle order is still the best we have. We are paying a heavy price for neglecting the opening situation as a 'pair' for few decades now. Did we ever hear of a great batting team which did not not know who will open on the eve of every series? Tendulkar, Laxman, Dravid and Younis Khan (Pakistan) have slogged it out to ensure that the team has a chance to last for 100 overs plus. To do this one needs to bat out a lot of dot balls till 40 overs, (when the middle order bats inside the first 14 overs)... Even in school and club cricket, we usually have openers who open. Until this is fixed as a 'pair', middle order batsmen will be doing a repair job to ensure it does not fall apart. In tests teams need to bat between 110-150 overs to be dominant/competitive. Hopefully, we found the openers who will be there as a 'pair' for some time.

Besides, The last few series India played have been low scoring, so scores need to be 'normalized' to the pitch conditions. I have mentioned how to do this in my Cricket book which analyzes situations using chess concept (Dot Chess- The Cricket in Between ISBN 8175258241).
And on a side note- India batted better then England in the wet conditions (days 2-5 at Lords). After it began raining, Engalnd lost 15 wickets in 320 runs, India lost 19 in about 480 runs. England were also lucky to get the best of the weather on day 1!

No wonder England are struglling in Trent Bridge day 1... Some more positional play from their top order was perhaps needed- like Tendulkar and Jaffer did in the first innings at Lords... Be ready for more positional play from the middle order folks!!! Tactics can only flow from good positions as Anand and other tactical GMs say in chess... Keep a close watch on the Fall of wickets by over number, not just runs to see how batsmen will play in this series.

Posted by: Ambar N. on 07/31/2007

This article, in spite of its "creative" use of statistics, is highly misleading. The reason? Statistics can be selectively quoted to pretty much support any pre-conceived notion. Let's look at a different set of statistics. Since the start of the Safrica tour, let's look at the stats for 3 players to dispel some myths. In 7 matches, not a small sample by any means (way more than 10 innings) Dravid has an average of 31.3, Ganguly 45.2. Take out B'desh, and the respective averages (in 5 tests for each player) are 20.4 and 46.1. Laxman has an average of 36 in 5 tests (didn't play against B'desh, perfectly in keeping with Lax's hard-luck story with Indian selectors)
So what is this nonsense about Dravid being on a different pedestal from SG, ST and VVS? Fact is, this article is extremely unfair to SRT and SG - SG didn't even play tests for the most of 2006 and he was in abysmal form for 5-6 tests before this which drags down his averages. Similar story for SRT since he was also laid low by injuries for a while.
My point is not to prove that RD is inferior to the rest (I think he is still one of the greatest but going thru a temporary rough patch), but simply to show that a differently creative use of statistics can prove the exactly opposite of what Mr.Bal has "proved". Since Indian cricket fans tend to have short and selective memories, here are some facts to consider. Ganguly was the highest scorer in Safrica in extremely difficult conditions for batsmen, and he didn't score just 30s. Since his layoff, SRT hasn't played that many tests against top tier teams. VVS was a fine performer in Safrica too, and had it not been for him and Gangs India would have lost 0-3. And finally, the grand myth of chucking these fellas and getting the youth in. Someone mentioned Raina. On the basis of what? An average of 17 with a highest "score" of 34 in the last 15 ODI matches he has played? One doesn't hand out national team caps just on the basis of age, someone has to be good enough to dislodge the established bats, and on current evidence NONE other than Yuvraj has even the remotest claim to that. Even Yuvraj's average in the last 5 tests he has played stands at an anaemic 19.1, and a career average of 33 over 19 tests is nothing to write home about either. But Yuvi's time will come I am sure, given his ability, but not because some "fans" with severe attention-deficit-disorder decide to dispense with some of the greatest bats the country has ever produced because of their age. Thank god the selectors do not listen to the fans. I suppose the selectors also remember the time not so long ago when a battered Indian team, after the grand experiment with "youth", desperately summoned Ganguly to Safrica to show some spine in batting after getting pulverized in the ODIs.

Posted by: aditya khandelwal on 08/02/2007

yes , india deserve to have luck in the form of rain which led them to drew first test.. This is after long time that india was able to save the test match despite of favourable conditions for the faster bowlers.. i think entire team has played well under the circumstances that are certainly not conjusive for them. Several times india also lost the oppurtunity to win the test game because of bad weather conditions.. so its now there turn to sit on the right side of the table.

  Post your comment
Name:
Email Address:
Comments:
Categories
AnalysisAshesAustralian cricketCaptaincyChampions Trophy 2006ColumnsCricinfoDomestic cricketDrugs in cricketEnglish cricketICCIndia in England, 2007India in South Africa, 2006Indian CricketInterviewsNew Zealand CricketPakistan cricketPakistan in South Africa, 2006-07ProfilesReviewsSouth African cricketStats etcTributeTwenty20 CricketWest Indies cricketWorld Cup 2007Zimbabwe
Recent Posts
Flawed yet fascinatingA matter of formatsMuddy waters run deepNo room for backboneThis game has just startedRoom at the topGood teams, good pitches, good cricketLessons from a salvoSympathy for the devilAway advantage
Archives
September 2007August 2007July 2007June 2007May 2007April 2007March 2007February 2007January 2007December 2006November 2006October 2006
Web Feeds
© Cricinfo 2008